Arsenal Banter Archive February 28 2015

28 Feb 2015 19:52:31
Wenger is still a good manager and has bought well over years in respect to the money he had available. The only thing he did not get right in the last 10 year's is buy a leader wether in defense or midfield, someone who would shout cajol bollock and stop the team doing what happened on Wednesday and have the respect of the players around him even if he was not as talented. In other words s Tony Adams. I heard an interview once were one of the old players said Adams once told berkamp before an important game isn't about Time a player of your ability won something. I rest my case

{Ed025's Note - just to put in my two penny worth...arsenal have been under restraint financially for the past 8 or 9 years due to the building of arguably the best stadium in the prem, but now the shackles are off there are no excuses..now i,ll shut up..

28 Feb 2015 20:12:26
Your input is invulnerable Ed and respeced by every poster I'm sure, your a gooner one step removed which in many ways makes you opinion even more valued mate. I'm sure I speak for the vast majority when I say please keep sharing your views mate

28 Feb 2015 20:18:58
Don't shut up Ed, you are totally correct.

I think Wenger has guided us through choppy waters.

Has had to sell all of our best players to compete with our mega rich rivals and to finance The Emirates move.

Despite the "shackles", he has continually achieved CL qualification, that is no mean feat.

He has taken a lot of stick, from other managers, pundits and even Arsenal supporters.

But, he has always stuck his head above the trenches, accepted the stick and has always defended his players, even when they have played poorly and let him down.

We have come through the barren spell, last years FA Cup success is testament to that.

I have waivered many times, in terms of my belief in Wenger, but he deserves our respect, and above all, has earned the right, yes earned the right, to see out his contract and the backing of all those associated with Arsenal, be it the board, owners and supporters.

28 Feb 2015 20:42:48
Completely agrew with everything that's been said here

Bravo gentlemen

:)

28 Feb 2015 21:04:52
The trouble is the big defeats, this banter page is a snap shot of the broader feelings amongst all Arsenal fans relating to Wenger and where we're heading.

I sometimes wonder if we're guilty of living in the past in believing something that our eyes are not seeing. The Invincible programme probably highlighted just that, especially as it was immediate to the Monaco game.

With the discussions of the Invincibles of how big a club we are and whether Wenger should go or stay it goes without saying that we're all sometimes a little guilty of looking at our own club with rose tinted glasses yet most believe they don't. The Invincibles more than most things is probably the cause of the majority of it, believing we have or can emulate that team with ease. Thus we kind of live off the past.

The thing is with that team, and everyone knows the story, it was a fantastic group, built or developed in an era when it was pretty much Manchester United and Arsenal going toe to toe for trophies.

They played some breathtaking football, won league and FA Cups yet never conquered Europe, came close but 2nd is always the 1st loser.

Be we couldn't build on that side as along came the stadium decision and rather than building on a fantastic squad it was the reverse and it was slowly dismantled, yes we came close to trophies and yes we still played great football but in a game awash with money when we had little, it never happened and the fourth place trophy was born, a comment made about how important it was we qualified for Europe during that period when money was tight, not that it was the limit of our intent, to simply finish fourth. It has haunted Wenger and us since. Many just brush over the meaning of the comment.

Teams like Madrid, Barca and United, the latter until the last few years of Fergies reign, where able to replace top players with other top players, thus were able to continue winning. Why United didn't is any bodies guess.

City, Chelsea and PSG have arrived in that group, been able to amass squads with huge amounts of money prior to FFP. Chelsea now a great example of being able to buy and sell to maintain momentum and quality of squad along with a great youth set up.

Add Bayern Munich to that group who have even managed through fantastic planning to build a World class stadium, have already paid it off and with no debt against the club and continue to win home and abroad.

Other teams like Dortmund, Lille or Atletico Madrid have occasionally spoiled the party but they are not the norm. Invariably the really big clubs win the trophies.

The Premiership has become the most competitive league in the world, irrespective of whether English clubs cannot win squat in Europe.

We have, to a degree, allowed ourselves to become a club living on the past, 9 years since a team worthy of the name. United are allowing themselves to do a similar thing after an unprecedented era of Sir Alex. Yes they are huge, yes they have money and it is difficult to see them not getting back to winning ways, but replacing Fergie with the right guy still seems a way off.

So we look at ourselves as a top 5 or 6 club based I guess on how we played as the Invincibles, yes we are the 8th richest club in world football and that will mean something, or should mean something, but not right now.

Like I've said before you cannot build a team under ffp in two summers and we are still in the process, unfortunately nights like Wednesday and games like United's 8-2 along with last seasons batterings do not help Wengers cause. In reality no big club or supposed big club should lose in that manner and people are right to point the blame at Wenger.

To me in those games we should have accepted ourselves as the Monaco or the Bradford and should have played like we did against City, to batten down the hatches to sneak a win or a draw as many have against us, not lose 5, 6 or 8 goals against.

We have tried to compete with the big boys on a budget and with an attacking philosophy without players of Invincibles quality to pull it off.

Is Wenger the man to buy the right players to fill the right positions and I now believe that to be closer to four than two. I know what I want the answer to be.

I want to afford him that opportunity because of what went before, almost like cutting my nose off to spite my face, hence why I say I'll hopefully wait until the summer. I accept the team, bar Ozil and Sanchez was built on a budget. Neither City, Chelsea, Madrid, Barca nor Bayern have had that concern.

There are many things staring many of us in the face that maybe we are turning a blind eye to in the hope of seeing a genius always remain as one. I truly hope he proves me right.

Whatever, I want us to win every single game and go into each one willing us to win it whether sense tells me the likelihood is slim. When your a football fan that's the way you think whether you follow Plymouth Argyle or Shamrock Rovers or bloody Arsenal.

I'd love nothing more than to see Wenger lift the EPL title again.

{Ed025's Note - i have to say red dog....that is probably the best post i have ever read on here, stunning quality and with unbiased frank views that made it an absolute pleasure to read mate..i tip my hat fella..awesome..

28 Feb 2015 21:20:14
If only lady bracewell smith had sold to usmanov I reckon we would of won the league by now. A great great shame still saddens me

28 Feb 2015 21:43:21
Top top post Red, as usual.

So good, I read it twice and thoroughly enjoyed it.

Respect.

28 Feb 2015 22:26:12
Total respect Red that's as good if not better than any post I've read, well thought out and expressed mate.
No Arsenal fan should be so set against Arsene that they want anything but a happy ending for him with us and to see him lift that premier league trophy one more time.
Until he either achieves it or bids farewell debate will continue about his modern day ability, but whether we feel he will or won't we should all want it for him and us

28 Feb 2015 23:13:08
Fantastic post red

28 Feb 2015 17:05:42
Chance to go 5 points clear of Southampton tomorrow

28 Feb 2015 17:35:59
On a positive note, I'll join you on that.

28 Feb 2015 18:12:02
On a slightly less positive and more cautious note let's see which Arsenal and Everton turn up tomorrow, both have the potential to be brilliant but both equally have the potential to be a lot less than brilliant.
I'm not sure at all what to expect from either side, I hope for a big response to Wednesday nights disappointing performance but wouldn't bet too heavily on it

28 Feb 2015 18:41:45
On a realistic one, it isn't a given, we will have to be tip top. Everton are in a confident mood at the minute

28 Feb 2015 14:28:07
Radio 5 were discussing Arsenal on Friday and said a few good points
1. We sucked in Europe and we have not progressed in that tournament for past few years
2. Fans need to be careful what they wish for when they ask for Wenger's head
3. We go on a bad run but end it before it's a crisis but also go on a good run but end it in a stupid game before we can be great
4. We should be pleased to finish 3rd given the vast financial inequalities between us and the top 2.
5. FFP will benefit us in the medium term

We have the money now but we can't spend enough to off set the sales over the past 8 years which have made our competitors stronger. We need to spend at least 100m on the first team plus money on the squad to get up to that level.

Wenger loves the club, is a great manager, has his fault but looks like he is not as stubborn as we thought. I do wish either him or Bouldy would get out there seats and shout at their players to - get chalk on their boots, don't leave space at the back, keep the pressing, keep showing for other players etc etc

Hopefully we bounce back tomorrow with style - I still trust Wenger but I also know Arsenal is bigger than him but also they are bigger and better because of him

28 Feb 2015 15:18:45
Sy4 I agree arsenal are bigger and better for wenger. But he got very well paid for a very good job, that I have always maintained NO other manager could have done, on a budget. But i'm sorry now the guy is out of his depth and he's not making good decisions, in fact he's making bloomers and tge game is moving ahead and he isnt.

28 Feb 2015 09:48:54
Welbeck and merts should be rested this weekend. Theo should be fit enough now to play 90 minutes and Gabriel has got to be worth a shot at the back alongside kos, or why did we buy him.
I think it's got to be worth starting Coq and flam ahead of ozil with cazorla through the centre and keep giroud up top.

{Ed025's Note - i dont see replacing santi with flam as a positive bacon, but the rest i like..

28 Feb 2015 10:45:36
In
Szczesney Gabriel Monreal Ox
Out
Ospina Orville Gibbs Welbeck

28 Feb 2015 11:29:54
Keep Giroud up top? My word you have faith...

28 Feb 2015 13:11:30
Giroud had an awful day at the office Wednesday night and isn't everyone's cup of tea full stop, personally I rate the bloke very highly and when someone who has worked has hard as Giroud for our team but has an absolutely terrible game then i think he needs and deserves our support more than ever.
I can think of a few who have given a lot less effort than Giroud and continue to be supported

28 Feb 2015 13:42:35
I don't really rate giroud, but he did come out and say he was embarrised by his performance, which is half the battle, hopefully he will come out all guns blazing to get it off his back. Leaving him to stew on the bench won't help him, plus what's the alternative? Welbeck? Shoot me now

28 Feb 2015 15:27:57
Like you say eden Giroud had the good grace to come out and admit he was embarrassed at his performance which puts him about 7 million x the man of a certain German giant who made it a hatrick of ducks by hiding behind silence. I'll take honesty every time over ego and pretence

28 Feb 2015 18:41:23
Sszsency
Chambers - Gabriel - Kos - Monreal
Coq - Wilshere
Walcott - Ozil - Sanchez
Giroud

Cazorla and Mertesacker have been massively overused this season. Id start Wilshere and bring on Rosicky later in the game. Walcott must be fit enough to start by now. Giroud has had 1 bad game and 6/7 good ones these past few months. He deserves to stay in the team.

28 Feb 2015 19:08:14
I'd swap Ox for Jack but apart from that ditto Detroit mate

28 Feb 2015 19:37:11
Forgot about the Ox, in that case yh he gets in ahead of Jack.

28 Feb 2015 20:02:50
We have so much quality in MF its easy to miss one mate and very difficult to leave some out, I just wish we had that problem in Defence where IMO only kos and Debuchy look ready for a real title fight. Gabriel Belerin Jenks Chambers may grow into the job of course

28 Feb 2015 09:05:59
Amy Lawrence has written an article which is on the BBC football website.

Titled: Why do Arsenal feel stuck under Arsene Wenger.

I think the article just about sums up how I feel.

28 Feb 2015 09:39:52
A very good article that Gooner, its never healthy for anyone in any walk of life to feel totally 100% secure no matter what as its often the thought of losing what you love that makes you question your actions and do the right things to keep it.

{Ed025's Note - very philosophical of you there G62 mate.. :)

28 Feb 2015 10:08:03
It was a bit mate wasn't it :-)

28 Feb 2015 00:36:03
Any one who slates wenger just watch the invincible documentary the man loves this club and I love him in wenger we trust and always will COYG

28 Feb 2015 07:23:01
Nobody is doubting Wenger's previous credibility or his invincible team, but Wenger's longevity is certainly in question.

I'm pro Wenger, but a good manager than is not necessarily a good manager now.

All players have a shelf life.
Maybe managers do too?

28 Feb 2015 09:15:42
Along time ago that team. I used to love kanye west back then. But he's changed too power man and has lost touch with reality.

28 Feb 2015 09:17:22
No one wants to see Wenger go for the sake of it, every single fan (some married ones too) would rather be worried about him leaving in two years time rather than think its a pittty he didn't go last summer.
Sadly there comes a time when you have to decide are you pro Arsene or pro Arsenal competing at the top level because I'm not sure the two are compatible any more.
I've been impressed by him accepting the need for Le Coq and also his willingness to play Monreal over Gibbs quite a bit lately simply because he seems to getting a bit tougher, if he sticks around for next season this does bode well for a summer clear out

28 Feb 2015 15:11:59
So lovin the club means someone is fit to lead the. On does it? In that case DAGS for manager!