Arsenal Banter Archive November 30 2014

30 Nov 2014 23:12:58
Just been reading some of your posts re Wenger/banners.

Again, anything Wenger related will always divide opinions, especially amongst Gooners.

Personally, I think its in bad taste, especially as we beat BD a few days earlier to secure CL qualification.

I'm all for voicing opinions but I think banners are crude, distasteful and reflects bad on the club as a whole.

As Ed025 said earlier, the 'Moyes out' banner that flew over OT was ridiculously insulting to David Moyes, but would be totally insulting to a manager who has served us for 18 years, through good times and bad.

There are always other ways. I think somebody said earlier about boycotting a game. This would be a better option, as Wenger and the board will listen because they are being hit in the pocket.

We all know Wenger is stubborn, has not addressed obvious weak spots in our team (defensive cover and DM), but he does deserve a little respect for continually getting us into Europe, whilst trying to compete with the sugar daddy clubs.

The man has 3 years left on his contract, if he leaves, it will be on his terms, ie end of the season, and not before.

He has earned our respect, although it has waivered over the past few years, but let's keep the respect going until the end of the season.

I think he deserves that.

01 Dec 2014 06:37:07
Respectfully disagree.

Wenger needs to know he has to up his game.

The fans that made that banner pay good money and expect/deserve more bang for their buck

If the banner only gets unveiled when we lose then it looks fickle and meaningless. That banner was made because of the last four-six YEARS of stagnation, not a knee jerk reaction to that farce against utd.

Even if it doesn't prompt wenger to leave it gives a clear indication of the feeling of disunity amongst fans/the club. Its a message not only to wenger but to gazidis, kroenke, puma, emirates and everyone with an invested interest in the club that fans want change

Perfectly put AG

Personally I would have preferred a more dignified protest of a boycott or something more suttle but the point has been made and it certainly needed making.
Driving Arsene out is still very much option 2 for me, I hope the shot across the bows of his and the never mind the football look at he bank balance attitude within the club brings about a change of direction in January.
Another Kim Kallstrom window and Saturday's banner will look positively friendly I suspect

01 Dec 2014 08:47:06
AG,

Like I said in post, anything Wenger related will divide opinion, and you make a fair point.

I see today he's banging on about 15 yeas of CL ko stages and he's changing for no one, grrrr the mans a fool to himself.
15 attempts 1 final
Liverpool how many attempts? how many finals with in the same time scale?
Chavs?
utd?
Shut up Arsene your embarrassing your self and much worse the club more than any banner ever could.

Dags respect. Are you saying bab the banner. If we win we get banners of support with people admiring and praising, the banners. why can it be ok for that and not for the opposite, I don't think youvcan have it one way. I don't think that is classless as some people have put.

01 Dec 2014 13:51:19
Steve,

Personally, its not a route I would go down, but If I saw banners at Emirates I wouldn't be overly disgusted.

I just don't think Arsene and the board pay any heed to it.
2 seasons ago the Arsenal black scarf movement held a 'protest' just before a game, it made no difference.

01 Dec 2014 14:08:42
How could you expect a boycott to work? I've said it many times we need a mass fan strike to address problems in the club (not wenger out) but we're a tourist venue now.

If the banner boys didn't go there's plenty of tourists in london with £60 on the hip, just waiting to drain the atmosphere.

Hey dags its not a route I would go down either, I can't spell. My banner could say anything.

{Ed025's Note - but it would be a moaning one steve.. :)

No your wrong there eds. I work shifts and i'm in bed in the moaning.

30 Nov 2014 21:05:55
Just spotted Banbury's reply to Welsh's compliment in a post further down, :-) top top quality that Banbury mate :-) from the top draw that many reach for but few of us ever manage to open.
Now that's banter :-)

30 Nov 2014 22:34:46
Yeah, I have just seen it too.

Top reply, all in good banter.

Respect to them both.

30 Nov 2014 20:54:47
I don't know how anyone can say that the banner yesterday was out of order. I think it's perfectly justified.

We pay the highest ticket prices in Europe to watch our side come fourth in England and get embarrassed in the last 16 in Europe every season, due to us finishing the group stages second to the likes of Dortmund, who pay a fifth of the wages we do!

When you pay top dollar you expect to be among the best, and in my opinion we've been paying to sustain medmediocrity for the past 9 years. We've been getting well and truly mugged off by Wenger and the board.

As for the man himself. If I'm not mistaken, he's the highest paid manager in Europe and still has the nerve to ignore the fans' opinion when he comes under fire and spout ambiguous nonsense to the press to avoid anything that actually questions his ability and resolve. And that's just off the pitch. It took us to suffer a humiliating defeat to one of our closest rivals for the stubborn old mule to actually change tactics and set up to kill of a game we were leading.

Not to mention his lack of key signings over the last 8-9 years.

When you consider what we pay for as fans, it's not good enough and in my opinion, Wenger is doing more harm than good.

Therefore I fully support the banner. The sooner he leaves, the better.

30 Nov 2014 22:40:26
Whether you support the banner or not, you have put up a good argument.

Fair play CIG.

Good post cig, it never hurt anyone and made its point, without malice of any kind.

I think Oleg made a very good point on the banner, if people can take pro Arsene banners then surely others are allowed anti ones too?
In a free country its hard to argue with that

Banner on the prices is fair play as we are abused. Not on AW, he has given us far too much!

I think I could'nt have put the message on that banner any better myself. I know its a subtle difference and ultimately means the same thing, but I am very anti the phrase Wenger Out, which IMO is completely insulting to a man who has given us such service. However, the message thanks for everything, but its time to go, is much more subtle and ultimately respectful than the other. Perhaps far from being classless, that banner shows we maintain class even when we question the clubs authority?

30 Nov 2014 18:53:28
Never a better time to play saints than Wednesday?
Today was tough for them and we need to capitalize on their doubts after drawing with Vila and losing to city.
3 wins on the spin? 3 clean sheets on the spin? Get the banners out, oh hang on :-)

{Ed025's Note - good stuff G62..

I think its a good time to play stoke as well, happy days then.

In fact Steve if all goes well against stoke as well as saints I think we should take on the entire league in an us against them mega match and strike while the iron hot, our 11 v their 209 bring it on, well as long as we beat both Saints and Stoke and keep clean sheets in both games that is

30 Nov 2014 20:29:11
If Man Titty can go to St Marys, go 1-0 up, have a player sent off, than score another 2, than surely we can beat them at home?

Than Stoke away is very winnable and we can start climbing the table.

Still worried about those injuries though.

Dags please stop worrying about all those injuries, no ones blaming you for them all, most but not all

30 Nov 2014 22:29:36
Shall I post them some jokes to cheer em up G62? Lol

30 Nov 2014 17:32:27
Steve
im not having a go but where do you get your information from.Because from what I know we are the 4th biggest wage payers.2013
Man city
Man utd
CHELSEA
Arsenal
ALSO TV

We are the 4th again
CHELSEA
Man utd
Man city
Arsenal

Commercial
WE are 5th
So my figures could be wrong
PREMIERSHIP 2013 financies
Steve, where are you figures from
So all in all, I think we are doing well getting fourth, yes I want better, but I have seen us a lot lower.
Im told that Roman the red doesn't attend as many games, where would chelsea be with out his input
Some say that the wenger stay is the minority, I hope that we see lots of different banner on weds

{Ed002's Note - Your figures are out of date with Arsenal now having a significantly higher wage bill (third highest). Mr Abramovich attends all (primarily home) games that he sensibly can. He is the owner of Chelsea and has been for many years, obviously they would be in a different position without him. Where would Arsenal be without Hill-Wood or Bracewell-Smith ever being involved? Did Herbert Chapman leave a legacy?}

Ed
my info
was from as stated.
MR Abramovich is seen at as many russian games now as he is chelsea, we all attend as many as we can.
Yes herbet chapman left a great legacy, the marble hall, did our fans put herbet out banner I think not

{Ed002's Note - You information is out of date and therefore of no significance. I can't see the significance between some banner about the Arsenal manager and your inane statement about the significance of the input the Chelsea owner has had with the club.}

Ed 2
So who have we leeped frog then, because I've just looked up and can't find any info on it

{Ed002's Note - Chelsea.}

Gd shout eds

30 Nov 2014 18:11:40
Thank you Ed :)

Welsh mate my point is we are more equal financially than people lead us to believe and probably spend more on wages than people realise. We have more high earners outside the first team than anyone. We have spending power to attract nearly who we want. We are up with the big boys in financial terms and not on the field. With ffp times are a changing. You won't like this but maureen blew everyone out of the water, spending less than us and improving more. From my point of view We are not keeping up on the field, not off it.

Oh and thanks eds, you put it better than me.

30 Nov 2014 15:49:12
On the great Arsene in out shaking it all about debate I think its naive of people to think its only a tiny minority who want change and if the only way to achieve it is for Arsene to go then
Its a very very tiny minority who still think he's doing a good job for our club, there's a big difference between has dine and is doing.
But I still think the overwhelming majority of fans first choice if such an option existed would be for Arsene to change before its too late, their was a sign on Wednesday and again yesterday that he is more open to change than ever before even if he will never admit it

I am very grateful to the fans that brought that banner - I am not in 'Wenger out' mode right now as I do not think we would immediately benefit from him leaving (not until the end of the season anyway), but it is good for Wenger to know that many of us are simply fed up. He needs to know that it's not enough for him to want to do better - we are the ones who it is worst for, and he needs to see the effect his management is having on the fans. Who knows - maybe it will inspire a Pardew-like turnaround.?

That's what we all want Oleg an unimaginable recovery that leads to a top 3 finish and CL SF or better.
There are those who wanted Arsene out 5 years ago and those who still think he is 100% right in all he does but the vast majority just want change with or without

OLEG
How you're grateful for that banner amazes me.
62, yes at times I have said he needs to go, then I sleep and think, what is out their better,
We have had some very very bad luck, injuries, Cock ups in the finale.
Wenger won't be out for long, VERY big clubs would all want him,
Yes he is a power control freak I know that.and yes maybe he needs another David Dein.
But let's not disrespect the man on live tv, for all he has done for our club
For me they were kids after 15 minutes of fame and got it

Welsh your optician has conned you with those glasses mate, just try taking them off for an hour just to see if it makes a difference.
There's sometimes a big difference between what we want to see and what's really going on.
15 minutes of fame or 5 years of denial? A fine line

Welsh you make valid points. But i'm going to make my point. Wenger stopped with us, these last 9 years and could have left to go to barca, real, Monaco, psg etc. If he had and performed the same for any of them, he would have been out years ago. he's not silly, he knows he's bomb proof at arsenal, he's got hold of part of the reins.

Oh and at real he'd have got worse than a bloody banner.

30 Nov 2014 11:57:34
Greetings all Gunners,

Firstly I would like to say I am a Celtic fan and have been browsing the club pages recently. I have came across a lot of you guys here talking about Victor Wanyama as a potential signing. As a fan of the beautiful game for umpteen years and seen some of the worlds greatest ply their trade, I can't speak highly enough of Victor Wanyama.

This guy oozes class, we knew it from day one and he always puts in powerful performance. When we played the unplayable Barcelona a few years back he was the best player on the park both home and away. The lad is physically unmatched by most players in the modern game and he can play with style for a big man.

The thing that gets me is when Wanyama was leaving us Arsenal and Liverpool were both in pole position to land him. He was willing to take reduced wages to join a bigger club and I have to say you goons made a huge mistake by not snapping him up for a measly £12 million and will most likely cost you double now.

Also I have seen a few speak of Virgil Van Dijk who is also a very talented fellow and will make it to the top one day.

Keep posting the good posts lads and keep your chins up, I mean it's not all bad you could be Glasgow Rangers lol.

I think some of the top clubs are reluctant to sign African players now because the ACON is every 2 years now. When the players come back they often come back in a bad state and at a time when the games come thick and fast.

Wanyama seem to be the perfect signing. Young talented and pretty cheap. Definitely a better option then flamini. The only reason I can think of why we didn't sign him was the fact we could lose him for two months of the season.

30 Nov 2014 13:34:29
Noodles Wanyama plays for Kenya who haven't qualified for the afcon since 2004 so he would unlikely ever be going away for those 2 months.

Would love him here, he was immense in those games against Barca and looks great at Southampton.

Surely the aoc isn't two months lol. One month max. Ken ya believe it

30 Nov 2014 11:11:36
As you all know I am not a fan of Arsene at the moment, he might pull off a miracle this year.

But the banner the Arsenal fans showed was bang out of order.

{Ed025's Note - and thats faiR enough imo BG..

As Ed has quite rightly said the banner reflects badly on our image as a club of decency and great value's and I believe voting with your feet and staying away is far better than putting the clubs name in the headlines for the wrong reasons.
But this always happens eventually when those in power refuse to listen to the paying public.
Let lessons be learned by all and move forwarded together with much less arrogance and much more consideration of what makes a club great both on and off the pitch

{Ed025's Note - Im all for that mate..

30 Nov 2014 11:36:09
Banbury I know you and I have opposing opinions or maybe it is just hopes but well said mate.

I haven't yet given up hope of Wengers 2nd coming. :-)

Gunner, I have to disagree with you. People should support their club and keep going, my opinion is they have a right to show their pleasure, and their displeasure, as long as it is non violent or aggressive. You can't win anyway because you would get called fair weather supporters and deserters. I don't think there is a best way to protest. Protest is protest, its not nice, but sometimes you have to.

30 Nov 2014 12:33:51
steve as a Wenger fan I totally agree that he should be aware of the feelings of the fans across the board and whilst I'd imagine it is mission impossible to simply walk up to him and have a chat about what fans think is missing or what they believe he is doing wrong I just don't agree with the banner.

Some United fans were classless enough to do it to Moyes last year which went against the grain of most of them.

For me Steve paying all that money to not enjoy the day while you could be doing something you do enjoy instead is pointless.
Empty seats are listened to with more understanding than chats will ever be.
Doing the away games but giving the Emirates a wide berth would certainly get the money hungry board taking more notice than any banner they never even see ever does

{Ed025's Note - i cant argue with that G62..

It is abanner. Its not swearing and spewing abuse at people, its a calm protest, it isn't as offensive as some vile fans. People keep saying its a minority, well I didn't see many people trying to pull it down. When I had kids at a match with me I had to put up with discruntled fans screaming obsenities and threatening behaviour, which was not nice, when they didn't like what they were seeing. I know what I prefer, its far more civilised than some are making out.

I understand what you are saying Steve but shows us in a disjointed light and possible turmoil, not something I like to promote. Keep in all behind closed doors and try to put a united front on when in the public eye.

It didn't look good at the end of the game to see that banner flying around

Yes but its not a very nice banner as you well know Steven, now let's hear no more of this distasteful behaviour and all settle down to a nice cup of Horlicks and listen to Arsene once again explain why we need 7 new keeper's and 54 left backs in January, i'm sure it will make sense this time if we listen carefully:-)

Banners
You have spoken more sence today then I have read of you for a while (LOL)
Respect mate

Welsh

Shame I can't say the same about you :)

Gunner my mum used to call me Steven when I was naughty.

30 Nov 2014 09:53:55
What is going on when so called fans hold a banner up like that, when we win
People sadly trying to have their fifteen minutes of fame.
They are a DISGRACE to our club
Get real people we don't have a right to win anything.We should have beat man utd, we qualified for europe, we beat dortmund, we beat west brom, and some wants his moment of fame
Ban them let them find a club that suits them.
Maybe celtic where the can cheer winning the title, or the welsh premier club TNS, they win most welsh things.
They have disgraced the club, our best ever manager.I bet they think WOW we are famous
now?
Sky and the paper will love stirring this up.
Yes Wenger has made mistakes, but the good outweighs the bad every year.
Maybe the older ones on here know what bad times are.
LIFE BAN for them
An ashamed welsh gooner

{Ed025's Note - well said mate..

30 Nov 2014 10:08:15
Well said Welsh, unbelievably pathetic!

Im so sorry you can't accept people with a different opinion than you. People in this country have a right to have a different opinion and rightly so. Some people want change and don't like the way things are, as long as its done in a manner that's not hostile, then, its a free country with a free opinoin. I accept you like wenger, that's your privilege, so accept people who dont. You don't have to like it, but as I said, its called opinion.

{Ed025's Note - opinions are fine steve, but united fans got slated for the moyes out banner being dragged by a plane (and rightfully so), we dont want to see clubs going down that route again do we?...it would be a shame to see arsenal tarnished with that same brush mate, i would like to think gooners are better than that..

Rock on Welsh - pity it's only the 0.0001% of 'fans?' who actually get portrayed on the media

The banner was completely OTT but so was evicting fans from the Emirates on Wednesday night for shouting Arsene out.
Two wrongs don't make a right, fans have the right to be angry with Arsene because let's face it his stubbornness and arrogance have hard to take for almost all fan's this season especially.
Protesting when winning seems a little bit silly but so does denying freedom of speach to paying fans at the Emirates

{Ed025's Note - i would like to think you lot are classier than that G62, mob mentality does not quite wash with me mate..

Absolutely. We all get frustrated with Wenger, at times, but the banner was shameful.
Don't let's forget, we are the current FA Cup & Community Shield holders. We are in the last 16 of the Champions League. We are 2 points off a top four spot and only 6 points off second place.
We have had to bed in 5 new players and have had huge injury problems, following a World Cup year.
Yesterday we played without he likes of Ozil, Debuchy, Wilshere, Ospina, etc.
Lets get behind Wenger and the team on Wednesday.

{Ed025's Note - im with you robbie..

To be fair mate if they are willing to pay the ridiculous prices set by our club to attend games they can rock up with any banner they want. Everyone has their own views and it's our God given right of Liberty to be able to express ourselves. You may not agree with their view or what they did but that doesn't make you a better fan than someone else.

{Ed025's Note - personally i think it does VDG..

So would I Ed but I'd also like to think the club isn't a dictatorship were any sign of discontent with Arsene is punishable by expulsion.
That really is making him bigger than OUR club

{Ed025's Note - the guy is not blameless G62 far from it, but for me the arsenal are a classy club, and i would hate for their supporters to be seen in a bad light thats all mate..

100% right Van
Who was the politician who said to the opposition mp ' I disagree with every word you say but I will fight to my last breathe to keep your right to say it '
The banner was ridiculous IMO but no more so than some of Arsene's decision's and tactics have been, but as said above two wrongs don't make a Right especially at the very time we started adapting our style a little

STEVE.Yes, I can't except that is the way to do it
I know you're one of the few wenger out brigade.
If arsene woke up this morning and thought, i'm not wanted i'm off.
What would happen in your opinion.Who would you want to replace him, and do you think that over the last 9 years a different manager may have done better.we don't pay the big fees and wages other clubs do, we are not a rich mans plaything, How many clubs have won the premiership in those 9 years.Would you like us to do a portsmouth, throw everything at it then plummet, I bet you would put away your gooner shirt then.
You say opinion? why don't those very few stop going to the game and not embarrass the club and manager like this.
Im not a trophy hunter i'm a gooner, I love the club to do the right thing, i'm sure other fans respect us the way we do our business.
Steve if 30% want wenger out should the 70% suffer those fools.
Why don't the minority sit outside the ground and show their disappointment,? WHY
because know one cares, but on a tv game the cameras, will pick it up and they will have their photos in the paper.
No life ban is hash, because I have looked again and see they are young, and probably never known what its like pre wenger.i just hope that the true arsenal supports show them, next time people try and impress our club by removing the banner,
I'm a gooner win lose or draw

Yes 100% right van. Fighting, obscene chanting, racism and throwing things are all wrong. Showing your feelingscon a banner, which might I say was not offensive and did say thank you. I have seen far more unsavoury protests in my time and far more offensive.

30 Nov 2014 13:14:05
Personally I would never hold up a banner like that. I'd be embarrassed by it.

My views on the Wenger situation? I want him to have some glorious Christmas epiphany wherein he returns to the Wenger of old and wins doubles galore for the next decade. With a couple of Champo Leagues because I'm dreaming.

But I don't think he's the man to do that and I think he's holding the club back now.

In terms of the banner? Minority? I very much doubt it. Obviously we can't poll every fans opinion but I reckon Wenger out is the Majority now however vicious they are about it.

Disgrace/Class? Disgrace is "Sack Fat Sam" banners, or the "pardewout.com" campaign.

"Wenger thank you for the memories but it's time to say goodbye" That's fair game IMO because it's exactly how a lot of people are viewing it.

If it's okay to have "In Arsene we trust" banners then the opposing view must be permitted, so long as it's wholesome.

Doing it after we've beaten Dourtmund? Well we're not expecting a 10 game winning streak and this week could very well be another papering over the cracks.

And the "so called fan" comment that some people are very fond of, is just ridiculous. No other fan is less dedicated than you because of their opinion.

Welsh your opinion and your facts and figures. We have the biggest gound in london, we charge the most for tickets, we have some of the biggest sponsorships, our wage bill is bigger than chelski, we earn more money than most from tv rights. The we can't compete with the likes of sheik city is not down to finance. People are not saying we have a right to win the league, but what we are saying is we have a right to challenge. We are miles away from that, we don't win big games anymore and we are stood still and in many peoples opinion, going backwards and one person is responsible for that. Wenger is bringing nothing to this team anymore. His tactics are failing.

30 Nov 2014 03:09:40
James McCarthy to potentially solve our problematic DM postion. What's your thoughts?

Not for me, a good player, but not a great player. I've never seen him take control of a game and command the game, like top players do.

{Ed025's Note - i hope arsene thinks the same steve...he is a quality player mate, who does a lot of the ugly stuff that comes without recognition, if he were in your side this season you would be in the top 3 deffo!...but if you do want him you will need to double that £16m offer mate, he is worth every penny..

I think he or Sissoko would be perfect signings, for a team aiming to be upper mid table. Surely a team looking to win things should have higher ambitions?

Everytime I have seen McCarthy I must admit I have been impressed with his dogged style and the boy can play but in this market a top British player for £16mil is unheard of (although we did get Welbz for that fee) I can't see it happening. Again my first choice would be a Bender brother or Schneirderlin but I would be more than satisfied with Wanyama or McCarthy as well.

Although I am very much certain the DM we bring in will be a surprise to us all.

30 Nov 2014 14:00:58
Van der Gun I wonder what he'd say if you called him british.

Sissoko for me. As much as I'd love an Irish player in the team again he's not up to scratch. A premier league mainstay absolutely but not a world class talent. I wish we picked him up at Wigan when he was still a teen. I don't think he's reached the heights he could have at 24. We need to be looking for WC talent.

I'm sure he is Scottish sheeny but his great great great great grandad was Irish so he choose to play for them.

01 Dec 2014 04:28:44
So how british is he? It was his grandad/ma. and that's not even how it happened

29 Nov 2014 23:33:46
Very impressed with our performance today guys. Another clean sheet is fantastic and I was glad to see Kos and Giroud in the first 11. It was a shame to see the OX on the bench as he is young and would like to play every game I'm sure. I was impressed with Santi and the young keeper in goal always looked sharp and alert.

Things are looking up. I'd be happy to poach 3rd this year and try to kick on for a title push in 2015/16!