Arsenal Banter Archive May 03 2017

03 May 2017 08:41:26
Saw a quote that seems to fit at Arsenal: "The best way to demotivate and lose top performers is to reward mediocrity in an attempt to maintain status quo"

Just seems so true, and the evidence is there when you look at the likes of Walcott getting big new contracts for, well I am actually not sure what for.

03 May 2017 09:48:54
Add Wilshere Artetta Rosicky Flamini and Mertesacker to that list too Ed001 how can the give something for nothing policy ever produce a hunger to achieve mentality within the club.
We are and have been for far to many years the jobs for the boys cosy club and what we see on the field and in the results over a season shows it perfectly, there is a conscious or subconscious attitude of " just do enough to maintain and protect what we have ' running through the club from top to bottom.

{Ed001's Note - good point g62. It was unfair of me to single out Walcott when there are so many other examples too!}

03 May 2017 09:50:34
As the extraordinarily well known 19th century American politician Gaylord Nelson said, "The ultimate test of man's conscience may be his willingness to sacrifice something today for future generations whose words of thanks will not be heard".

Messrs Kroenke and Wenger could heed these words and do the decent thing and recognise when their race is run, as it most surely is.

google: it's a wonderful thing!

{Ed001's Note - extraordinarily well known! Hahahaha. Though you have to question how anyone could forget a man with a name like that???}

03 May 2017 10:16:02
Theo is a great example thought Ed001 mate because if he'd been at a club where a lot more was expected of him, even demanded of him, how much better could he have been?
But Theo fitted in nicely as he was happy to take turns rather than fight for one place to make his own like other players do at other clubs.
This is why the Ox has to leave Arsenal if he ever wants to be all he can be as a player because he's most definitely Arsene's favourite player to leave out or sub off for no apparent reason.

{Ed001's Note - do you think the Ox has it in him to be more, or do you think he has grown happy with how things are at Arsenal?}

03 May 2017 10:17:42
I thought exactly the same thing when i read we are ready to offer the ox 100k a week. Here we go again! Yes he's improved over the last few months, but only really because he's been so inconsistent, injury prone and unable to make the team before! I wish him all the best and hope it proves shrewd so he doesn't skip off on the cheap, but if he regresses and turns out to be more suitable for a mid table team, none of them will be prepared to take those wages.

03 May 2017 10:34:01
I just can't see how a man who used to be a visionary and was so good for football can go from that to utter delusion.

03 May 2017 10:41:23
Are you talking about Gaylord Nelson there Sanogo?

03 May 2017 10:49:37
Wasn't he the one in meet the parents 😂.

{Ed001's Note - ah yes, now it all makes sense.....}

03 May 2017 13:25:56
It's a good point about the Ox Ed001 maybe he been here to long to change now, shame if he has because pre 2014 world cup I thought he looked a real prospect.

{Ed001's Note - he did up until the point he signed for Arsenal ;-)

03 May 2017 13:38:58
It's a sad state ed, as you know I've stuck up for Wenger countless times in the past as I thought he deserved to be given a chance for a period after money was available and I don't think I've ever felt so let down.

Even now it's hard to slate him as such but he really has got us into a bad position, like 62 says where or what was the thinking behind these signings.

I think not just rewarding mediocrity but buying similar. We have waited for these players, particular Walcott and Wilshere to be something they're clearly not.

Flamini's last year, Arteta's last year and Mertesacker just really beggar belief.

There, when you really open your eyes as I now have, are so many things wrong here, player contracts, wage structure, training methods, injury records but worst of all Wenger's ability to do what he did 13yrs ago. He seems totally lost, unable to motivate or really know what to do next.

We really are running the risk of causing ourselves, as a club, damage that will take more than a few seasons to repair.

That our future lies in the hands of Kroenke doesn't fill me with anything other than dread.

{Ed001's Note - he has just lost touch with reality. Total dictators do, as there is no one to say anything other than yes.}

03 May 2017 15:01:34
I think the Ox should move on for the good of his career.

Honestly it'd be nice to start over this summer with a new manager, lots of space in the squad and enough money for the new regime to build their own team.

Ed001, do you think it'd be better for Arsenal to switch to a more continently style of managers staying for shorter periods of time or for Arsenal to look to appoint someone who can stay at the helm for a long stint ala Wenger?

{Ed001's Note - the continental system has a sporting director that stays at the helm for the long term, who provides the continuity. They do a large portion of the role that a manager currently does, while the head coach, who is the one that is often changed, looks after the team given to him. Arsene is already basically a sporting director, he doesn't take training (except for the cameras), so the continental system is already in place. A sporting director for the long term, who then brings in a head coach.}

03 May 2017 15:12:40
Arsene doesn't take training?! That serious? I thought he did. If he doesn't who does? If that's the case wouldn't it be better to get someone to train and manage the team whilst he continues to do whatever he is doing in the background. Or will he never allow that.

{Ed001's Note - all I will say is that there have been questions asked by some players about what he actually does do as he does not take training. Mind he is a manager, not a coach. He has coaches like Bould to do the coaching.}

04 May 2017 09:42:13
There you go! Steve Bould does the coaching. Out of all the past players we have had it's steve bould who gets the gig.

03 May 2017 05:43:02
Just got one question, I don't want this discussion dragged into a Wenger in/ out thread though, so please try to keep to the discussion!

You can have any manager in the world in charge of Arsenal next season (including Arsene), who would it be and why?

For me, if I was an Arsenal fan, I would probably look at Nagelsmann. His CV is impressive for such a young guy. He is tactically astute, always looking to new ideas, like Arsene when he first arrived in England. Plus he would provide the long term stability that has been key to Arsenal's success over the years.

03 May 2017 07:12:02
I would like to see what Tuchel could do with our squad. I think he would have more of our players playing with zest and passion. I have also read about his training methods and I think they could rejuvenate some players who have the ability but have become jaded. I also like think Tuchel has a good eye for young talent and will improve on what is already here .

{Ed001's Note - even though he has shown himself to be too clever for his own good and been caught out tactically a hell of a lot, particularly this season? Oh and Tuchel is not involved with recruitment at Dortmund, other than to ask for a particular type of player, he just coaches, not scouts and recruits. So not sure what you mean by he has a good eye for young talent.}

03 May 2017 07:22:21
I didn't know that Ed001. Do Dortmund have a similar set up like Bayern then? I just assumed Tuchel was involved in decisions involving scouting and targeting of players.

{Ed001's Note - very few professional clubs abroad use the English system. Dortmund have a sporting director who is in charge of recruitment. I think it is still Michael Zorc, who performed the same role during Jurgen Klopp's time there.}

03 May 2017 07:24:42
Conte would be ideal. The problem is that he is no doubt unavailable, as are many of the top managers. The better question would be, which manger, including Wenger, that we have a relistic chance of enticing to the club, would you want? If he hasn't already extended his deal, it's Allegri for me.

03 May 2017 07:24:45
It's a difficult one because so many things point toward us being in a position of real weakness, losing players and the real European football for next season.

Would a household name like Simieone or Allegri want to actually come here and what would Kroenke and Gazidis do to convince them.

Nagelsmann or Tuchel would still look at a move here as a big step up, would Simieone or Allegri.

I don't like Sam Allardyce but him on a 12 month contract kicking these prima Donna's up the arse might do us good. I jest but they so need a leader with some steel.

I see Nagelsmann's playing career finished through injury at 19 so he fits our requirements on that front. 😁

Ed I personally wouldn't mind him but with such a short time in management would his backroom staff be really important along with this muted director of football at Arsenal.

{Ed001's Note - that is always a possibility, but there is nothing to stop him bringing that with him. He would certainly need, as would almost everyone you could bring in, some kind of director above him, as he works with one there.}

03 May 2017 07:35:43
Ed001, so do German clubs employ coaches who they think will fit into the structure already in place? Excuse my ignorance, I'm just interested.

{Ed001's Note - yes. The Sporting Director is often the one who chooses the head coach.}

03 May 2017 08:00:14
Ed001, thanks for taking the time to reply to my questions, appreciated.

{Ed001's Note - no worries N14. Got to ask, just out of curiousity, but your name is not because of Walcott is it? I assumed not initially, but then realised that it could well be nothing to even do with football. It could be your house number or anything.}

03 May 2017 08:20:20
Ed001, the number has personal meaning for me and also has connections to, in my opinion, Arsenals' greatest player. Walcott is nowhere near that level.

{Ed001's Note - that is what I thought, Henry, or a personal thing, but I saw something about Walcott being the current number 14 and wondered if I had it wrong.}

03 May 2017 08:20:53
Patrick Veiira, I'm not sure he would be the absolute best man for the job of turning things around quickly or possibly at all but he would unite the club and that's something that needs doing IMO.
He seems to have done a decent apprenticeship at city and in America which of course doesn't compare to many other candidates on field achievements but I do think he would be very much his own man which and unafraid to do what needed to be done and get the fans backing from day one.

03 May 2017 08:53:39
Ed thanks for the reply and he would be a breath of wonderfully fresh air, it's all about whether the board can take that leap of faith, does Kroenke have the stomach to try it.

Also hope you don't mind if I ask but always really wanted Klopp to manage at Arsenal and still love the guy but his time at Liverpool has been, to me, a little disappointing.

I say that in relation to some of his buys and other areas he seems happy with but what look to most like he needs to upgrade, examples being LB and GK.

His record is almost the polar opposite of Wenger as in besting the top 6 but losing to the lower sides although Arsene has appeared to have perfected that now!

So are you happy with him, do you think it's all going in the right direction, is he being backed financially.

Appreciate it's not in line with your OP so if you don't want to answer no worries.

{Ed001's Note - he does want to buy full backs and there are just no attainable goalies to buy so he is looking to coaching to fix the issues. Monday night did suggest Mignolet has made a huge step forward, actually taking catches under pressure!

I am very happy with him. He is far from perfect, he tends to leave it too long before making subs for my mind, for instance. I also do not like the public criticism of Sturridge which was incorrect, as he now admits himself. However we are clearly improved massively over the previous regime but it will take time.

When you consider Man Utd have the most expensive squad in football history, Man City, Chelsea spending huge sums, even Arsenal pushing the boat out, Liverpool do not financially have the capability to compete on that level. So we need stability and to be patient and look to long term growth.

As for being backed, Wijnaldum and Mane were big money buys against the advice of some within the club, so he is certainly being backed by the owners.}

03 May 2017 12:16:30
I would have him here ed if it were possible and agree I watch all your games and been more and more impressed with Mignolet.

Mane has been your best buy and your front line is awesome.

A complete side issue and probably a bit far down the page now to answer but a mate whose a Liverpool fan thought Vardy would be a great signing for you.

Would you imagine he would be a good fit for Klopp?

{Ed001's Note - no, I don't think he would have fit at all. He would be better for someone like Pulis. He needs the long ball over the top to chase to get the best out of him, which requires a team to play from deep. Klopp favours the complete opposite.}

03 May 2017 12:46:36
Didn't read all the comments but I will go for Allegri.
His defensively genius, so he can start improving the team from the back on.

03 May 2017 14:01:02
Not based on any feeling that he will fit at Arsenal but for me I would love us to sign Jardim. Watching some of Monaco's games this year has been an absolute delight, and i believe some of the attacking football they play most reminds me of the quality of football we used to play in the days of Viera, Henry, Pires etc (i. e. when we used to actually play forward rather than sideways) . I understand that despite Monaco being known as an attack only team (ie can't defend) , Jardim did actually keep the team as a defensive set up until he felt he had the players and quality to change the style. That seems pretty good to me. Also I like how he seems to be getting the best out of established but previously thought washed up players like Falcao. This bodes well that someone could come in and start getting players such as Ramsey and the Ox etc to start playing to their potential on a regular basis. Finally of course, he also looks like the sort of manager who would give youth a chance. We have Maitland-Niles, Rene-Adelaide, Beiliek, Campbell, Chambers to name a few, who should be given a chance to play for Arsenal, rather than playing on loan in the championship or league 1 etc. Add the fact that Jardim would also get a hopefully decent transfer budget to add quality players around a youth core, with the fact that win or lose, we would get decent quality attacking football that we all like to watch, Jardim gets my vote.

03 May 2017 13:24:32
That's what I thought ed, I was thinking because Vardy is a runner he just thought he'd suit Klopp's pressing style.

Didn't make sen me either.

{Ed001's Note - yeah people often don't actually know what the style of play is.}

03 May 2017 15:10:20
Interesting you'd support Nagelsmann getting the job, and I agree he's shown himself to be innovative but he's inexperienced at the highest level (e. g. European competitions) and would therefore represent a risk.

Ideally the next manager of Arsenal would be Allegri, his recent switch to a 4-2-3-1 shows he can play a more attacking style of play whilst also maintaining the defensive stability that Juventus epitomise. Saying that I'd still take Ancelotti or Jardim.

Just out of curiosity what's your opinion on Simone Inzaghi as a manager?

{Ed001's Note - impressed so far, but I haven't seen enough Italian football to really judge him, whereas I tend to catch quite a bit of the Bundesliga here on TV.}

04 May 2017 06:24:34
jardim, tuchel, nagelssman, allegri all would be better than wenger. wenger is tactically a dinosour. He needs to go.